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Nika

Is anyone keeping sand cockroaches (Arenivaga species)?

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Hello again :)

Sorry to bother you again, but unfortunately Kyle seems to be so busy at the moment that he was not able to send me Arenivaga roaches yet. Do you by chance know anyone other than him who is selling these roaches? And I wanted to ask, if there is maybe anybody who collected some dead roaches and could send them to me? I am quite desperately looking for these and I couldn't find any breeder in Europe selling Arenivaga species. For now I am still working with Polyphaga aegyptiaca (luckily they seem to do very well with lots of egg cases, but nothing hatched yet :D) but this species seems to have other adaptations for drinking than what I want to investigate in Arenivaga.
Thank you in advance!

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Same problem here... I haven't found anyone in Europe selling these roaches, or let alone having them in the first place. 
I have been considering to order them by Kyle, but the costs and the minimum amount to spend, I've so far refrained from doing so. But perhaps if several people place an order together? Or if someone can send you an ootheca? 
It's a shame that we here in Europe haven't managed to get Arenivaga species. Or one of the many African desert species. No one seems to consider some serious digging on their holidays in Egypt or so in search for some interesting beasts :)

You want to investigate the water collecting mechanism as described in Arenivaga? Do you have any idea how Polyphaga species can derive water from the soil? 
 

 

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In the last days I have asked some other people, who in turn are asking other people... so if I find someone selling Arenivaga or a closely related species, I will let you know! Maybe it could be possible to place an order together to lower the costs for everyone. Are you interested in any specific Arenivaga species? I wanted to buy A. genitalis and A. tonkawa and am still hoping that Kyle answers my E-mails soon! :)  Of course it would also be great to get an ootheca, but unfortunately it is not easy to predict when or even if they are hatching, so this could result in a lot of waiting. :D But would be still happy for every animal I can get!  I also considered digging for roaches in the sand, but I think the university will not pay for my vacation in the US. :D:D

Yes, I am interested in their ability to condense water vapor on structures at their mouth. So far it is described in literature that Polyphaga aegyptiaca is not able of this condensation mechanism but I found structures which are similar to those already found in Arenivaga. In some other experiments quite a few years ago, P. aegyptiaca just seemed to lick up liquid water with their hypopharynx. This makes it even more interesting to compare the species!

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This is a very interesting topic! I've read a number of articles on the condensation / water collecting system. One thing I'm wondering is how the Polyphaga obscura/saussurei/aegyptiaca manage to get moisture from their environment. If they do not have a condensation mechanism, do they manage to get it from moist soil by eating it? 
I find it hard to believe that they can only collect from liquid sources. 
I have the feeling that there is some 'white space' on the knowledge map of the Polyphaga genus. 
Or what about species as Heterogamisca chopardi (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0140196305800369)... 

And yes, place an order together has also been on my mind. I'm interested in any of the Arenivaga species. 

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Hello again! :)

Sorry for taking so long to reply! At the moment I am still not sure how they manage to get enough water, but besides the condensation mechanism I don't know any specific other mechanism described for sand cockroaches. Water uptake via the soil could be a possibility, but I have never observed the roaches eating moist soil. What I cold see several times was that one of my large females came up to the surface and started to lick water after I moistened one corner and there were still droplets of water on the box.
To me it is still a puzzling thing is that I saw several structures in nymphs and females of Polyphaga aegyptiaca under the microscope that look very similar to those found in Arenivaga investigata and are responsible for the water vapor uptake. I think this was not described yet and to me it just does not make any sense to have these structures but not use them for condensation. I wonder why these maybe lost their functionality?
Heterogamisca chopardi also looks interesting! Did you also see that Heterogamia syriaca seems to be able to condense water vapor, too? (http://agris.fao.org/agris-search/search.do?recordID=XE8311535 ) I think the paper is not available online but if you are interested, I could send you a scan. :)

Unfortunately, Kyle from roachcrossing didn't answer to my mails yet. I want to test the animals for a possible missing step how they actually manage to extract the condensed water from the fine hairs. But for this we would need live animals to do some video recordings while they are absorbing. :(
A colleague of mine is flying to Washinton D.C. in november for a conference and could bring the animals to Europe if someone ships some animals to a friend of mine in Washington D.C. Does anyone know someone who is willing to ship Arenivaga within the US (besides Kyle)? This would make me really happy! :D
Stanislas, if you still want to have some Arenivaga too, maybe we can share an order. My university will take care of the export and import stuff that needs to be done and there is probably a higher possibility that at least some animals will arrive alive.

So I am thankful for any ideas where to get Arenivaga in the US :)

Nika

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I would love to read that paper about Heterogamia syriaca (stijn   ad    applesnail   dot  net). 
I also wonder how these roaches acquire water from their environment. In a Chinese article, it's mentioned that Polyphaga obscura can survive in soil with little water for months. And in an article about soil roaches (need to look it up) that live in the Saudi desert also indicated that there are more cockroach species that might have an advanced mechanism to retrieve water from their environment. I'll look those papers up...

I wouldn't be surprised of several species have a vapor condensing capacity. Once my Polyphaga saussurei ootheca have hatched, I can send you nymphs. The same for Eupolyphaga sinensis. Let me know if you have interest. 

I definitely would like to share an order with you!  
 

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Hi stanislas!

To keep you updated, unfortunately I couldn't place an order yet, but if there is a chance and you are still interested, I will let you know! Maybe there is a chance for me to work further on this project in the next years and then I will definitely need the roaches :D I sent you an email with the paper about Heterogamia syriaca, did you receive that? I would be very happy, if you could send me the titles of the papers you mentioned (as long as it's not solely Chinese). :)

My Polyphaga aegyptiaca seem to be very resistant in dry conditions as well as they can endure long periods of desiccation and large weight losses. But no signs of water vapor absorption in these animals yet. :( How are your roaches doing?

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It arrived! Thanks a lot. Very interesting! 
I've send you a reply and I will send you articles/article titles later today or tomorrow. 

 

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I'm trying to contact Kyle to see if he is able to provide Arenivaga species and have then send to Europe. 
Or perhaps other sources? Or find someone willing to send ootheca to Europe? 

 

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It seems like Kyle is AFK.  I haven't been able to reach him for weeks, and I hear others longer than that.

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