aoikirin Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Dominos, orange domino, question marks... I know the rule is usually that species of the same genus MUST be kept separate to avoid interbreeding. Is hybridization possible within Therea? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hisserdude Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 In theory it's possible, but I am unaware of anyone who actually interbred these species. That's not to say it can't be done, but I don't think anyone's really made the mistake of keeping two Therea together in the same enclosure, (at least not in conditions needed to breed), and no one seems to really want to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allpet Roaches Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 It might be a good experiment. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hisserdude Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 6 hours ago, Allpet Roaches said: It might be a good experiment. I admit, it would be cool to create an "orange question mark" hybrid, or something along those lines, only if it were done well though and we didn't end up with unlabeled hybrids in the hobby like we did with Blaberus and Gromphadorhina... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whowadat Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 Hello, I would like to resurrect this old thread which came up in a Google search....I've always kept my colonies of Domino and Question Mark separate....its not that difficult to do given that they have distinct patterns and a general size difference with Domino being larger in my experience. They were acquired some 4-5 years ago from a reputable roach breeder/aficionado. Due to colony growth I now have split those two colonies into 4...two of each species. Recently I sold a group of 12 or so of the Question Mark roaches....we always provide the largest nymphs in the colony. The buyer got back with me after a few weeks with a picture of a recently molted adult with an unusual pattern....a pattern that resembles a "flag" waving in the wind. I let them know its not uncommon to have weird patterns show up on occasion with roaches in the Therea genus. I have pictures of Therea roaches which are practically all white for example. When I went to feed/mist the colony that contained the largest nymphs....hence the one we bring to reptile shows and sell out of....I was surprised to see approximately two dozen adults all with the same "flag" pattern that the earlier buyer had shown me. As of this typing there are no adults in the colony which have the expected "?" mark pattern. There are currently over 2-3000 nymphs in this colony....I am enjoying what I refer to as a "bloom" wherein many large nymphs molt into adults at the same time. I'm gonna have a hell of a show this time next year! (and I'll earn my advanced "Roach Wrangler" badge as these guys are quick) Anyways....my first thought on seeing two dozen with all the same pattern was the possibility of Domino adults having bred with QMs inside this bin. But, the odds of that are extremely slim given my anal approach to keeping all my bins secure from other roaches and other pests like spiders and whatnot. And I thought, although the odds of a single female getting into the bin is greater then multiple females getting into the bin...given that I mist and feed these colonies weekly, if I came across a Domino in the QM bin (or visa versa) I would of immediately pulled it out....how could a single female of laid so many oothecae into the substrate in a relatively short time. I mean the adults only live 4-5 months, with feeding/misting weekly that's 16-20 opportunities for me to of seen this possible Domino female(s) and get her out of there. I've never seen an adult Therea species in the wrong tub in the 4-5 years I have kept them....never. So my questions to others is....how many ootheca(e) does a single female Question Mark/Domino roach lay during their short adult lifespan ? If these are hybrids due to one or more Domino roach females getting into the QM tub.....shouldn't I expect to see the more common '?' pattern in the vast majority of the adults within the colony ? If the colony winds up having nothing but these "flag" patterns....and I'm talking about the possibility of thousands over the next 12 months...at what point do we have a different Therea species on our hands...or at least a different "strain" like we might see with Blaberus craniifer for example ? Pictures and a link to a video available soon.... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hisserdude Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 2 hours ago, whowadat said: Hello, I would like to resurrect this old thread which came up in a Google search....I've always kept my colonies of Domino and Question Mark separate....its not that difficult to do given that they have distinct patterns and a general size difference with Domino being larger in my experience. They were acquired some 4-5 years ago from a reputable roach breeder/aficionado. Due to colony growth I now have split those two colonies into 4...two of each species. Recently I sold a group of 12 or so of the Question Mark roaches....we always provide the largest nymphs in the colony. The buyer got back with me after a few weeks with a picture of a recently molted adult with an unusual pattern....a pattern that resembles a "flag" waving in the wind. I let them know its not uncommon to have weird patterns show up on occasion with roaches in the Therea genus. I have pictures of Therea roaches which are practically all white for example. When I went to feed/mist the colony that contained the largest nymphs....hence the one we bring to reptile shows and sell out of....I was surprised to see approximately two dozen adults all with the same "flag" pattern that the earlier buyer had shown me. As of this typing there are no adults in the colony which have the expected "?" mark pattern. There are currently over 2-3000 nymphs in this colony....I am enjoying what I refer to as a "bloom" wherein many large nymphs molt into adults at the same time. I'm gonna have a hell of a show this time next year! (and I'll earn my advanced "Roach Wrangler" badge as these guys are quick) Anyways....my first thought on seeing two dozen with all the same pattern was the possibility of Domino adults having bred with QMs inside this bin. But, the odds of that are extremely slim given my anal approach to keeping all my bins secure from other roaches and other pests like spiders and whatnot. And I thought, although the odds of a single female getting into the bin is greater then multiple females getting into the bin...given that I mist and feed these colonies weekly, if I came across a Domino in the QM bin (or visa versa) I would of immediately pulled it out....how could a single female of laid so many oothecae into the substrate in a relatively short time. I mean the adults only live 4-5 months, with feeding/misting weekly that's 16-20 opportunities for me to of seen this possible Domino female(s) and get her out of there. I've never seen an adult Therea species in the wrong tub in the 4-5 years I have kept them....never. So my questions to others is....how many ootheca(e) does a single female Question Mark/Domino roach lay during their short adult lifespan ? If these are hybrids due to one or more Domino roach females getting into the QM tub.....shouldn't I expect to see the more common '?' pattern in the vast majority of the adults within the colony ? If the colony winds up having nothing but these "flag" patterns....and I'm talking about the possibility of thousands over the next 12 months...at what point do we have a different Therea species on our hands...or at least a different "strain" like we might see with Blaberus craniifer for example ? Pictures and a link to a video available soon.... Mike You could have had a single MALE domino get into your ? colony, breed with some females, and then die pretty quickly afterwards (males are shorter lived than females, and in a large healthy colony it could have easily evaded detection IMO). That sounds like the most plausible option to me, especially since isolating a specific morph of ?s would have likely taken a lot more effort than that, whereas some roach hybrids have more vigor than their pure bred counterparts and could easily outcompete their pure bred parent stocks in the same container (not to mention, interbreed with them and make all the individuals in there hybrids after a generation or two). So, IMO, it sounds like you're got a hybrid culture, which you should isolate and perhaps destroy, or at the VERY LEAST, label correctly as T.petiveriana X T.olegrandjeani. You could also try purposely making hybrids in another bin, and compare them to these "flagged" individuals of yours, just to confirm that they are in fact hybrids. But I'd definitely hold off on selling any more from that colony, short term profit isn't worth potentially causing properly labeled, pure stock Therea spp. to become scarce, like we're seeing with other roach genera in the hobby... Mislabeled hybrids are quite simply, a cancer in this hobby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amazing Nature Posted April 22, 2023 Share Posted April 22, 2023 I know this is an old thread; but thought I'd share as id read this thread in the past. So I just stumbled on this statement in an article about Therea... Disclaimer: I don't know the level of expertise/knowledge of the author-if statements based on other knowledge they have and only assumed to be so with Therea or if this is factual and proven so, with that take what you will from it, "Most of these roaches rely on tactile or chemical cues to find their mate which helps prevent hybridization or the interbreeding of different species with one another. Thus, even if different members of the Therea sp. Are kept together in the same terrarium in captivity, they will not create a hybrid because of the different tactile and chemical cues emitted by each species isdifferent, and will not be recognized by other species of the same genus." I would consider an experiment but... 1)only have just gotten nymphs myself - 2) if the sexual organs even slightly differ would just stress them-but knowing this could determine it without putting them together possibly-if they wont 'fit' together that is the answer would be no; not physically possible. but where to source /drawings/photos -of reproductive parts? idk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amazing Nature Posted April 22, 2023 Share Posted April 22, 2023 what became of the posters flag pattern Therea? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hisserdude Posted April 22, 2023 Share Posted April 22, 2023 12 hours ago, Amazing Nature said: I know this is an old thread; but thought I'd share as id read this thread in the past. So I just stumbled on this statement in an article about Therea... Disclaimer: I don't know the level of expertise/knowledge of the author-if statements based on other knowledge they have and only assumed to be so with Therea or if this is factual and proven so, with that take what you will from it, "Most of these roaches rely on tactile or chemical cues to find their mate which helps prevent hybridization or the interbreeding of different species with one another. Thus, even if different members of the Therea sp. Are kept together in the same terrarium in captivity, they will not create a hybrid because of the different tactile and chemical cues emitted by each species isdifferent, and will not be recognized by other species of the same genus." I would consider an experiment but... 1)only have just gotten nymphs myself - 2) if the sexual organs even slightly differ would just stress them-but knowing this could determine it without putting them together possibly-if they wont 'fit' together that is the answer would be no; not physically possible. but where to source /drawings/photos -of reproductive parts? idk Unfortunately it seems pretty clear they can hybridize in captivity, and I've since become aware of at least one person who had this happen... so yeah, gotta be careful who you buy from, and in maintaining proper containment procedures. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amazing Nature Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 just saw the reply-thanks- I myself was wondering because some of my domino throw almost question mark looking joined dots/band pattern Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amazing Nature Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 hey,so I entered the quote I had pasted and found link to article just in case you want to read it i didnt copy paste the whole thing above but heres a bit more "There has been no record or reports of a Therea sp. hybrid. Even in the wild, where the different members of the Therea sp. have overlapping habitats, they do not interbreed. Tactile cues are often the vibrations emitted by and individually felt in the substrate; each species has a vibration made unique by their gait. For their chemical cues, pheromones are released so they can easily attract a mate. In contrary, a few species of roaches rely on acoustic (sound) signals and visual cues to attract a mate." Question Mark Cockroach – Animal Scene Magazine just saw this at bottom of page/article This appeared as “It’s the What Cockroach?” in Animal Scene’s September 2015 issue. further search revealed its published in the Philippines so maybe a breeder wrote this?- or gave the info? seems pretty specific though like an entomologist level info-or they read an article by an entomologist if anyone knows/has for a fact hybrids they should contact these people/website/article author so they can update the information it goes without saying keeping 2 different types together is a BAD idea just in case anyways but with an article like this someone might attempt a setup with white and orange spots together just for visual appeal and make hybrids on accident which we def don't need in hobby I have some domino that threw a band sometimes and first thought it was a mixup/ (or a question mark got in (on the sellers end as I only bough 12 orange and 12 white nymphs)which have been separate throughout (I just got them last January-of 12 two have had a white band/(2 joined dots) running lengthwise along middle lower of wing- i can post pix if wanted I've seen others have pix/vid of same so wasn't/not sure if mine were mixed/t.p and t.o. or just genetic randomness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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